Possible bug I found,

This deck
https://deckbox.org/sets/800596
says it is legacy, but it appears modern legal to me. It is an old standard deck from TSP/RAV standard.

am I missing something?

Ancestral Vision is banned in modern.

Ancestral Vision is Banned in Modern.

is something in this list banned too?
https://deckbox.org/sets/801951

this is another one, did they ban top? I cant keep up with modern I guess :P

Yup.

I looked at the list, thought, "probably Sensei's Divining Top", and looked it up.

Modern Banned List

Kammikaze wrote:Modern Banned List

Lazy man's method :)

That is a hell uv a wierd Banned List

Shoe wrote:That is a hell uv a wierd Banned List

What cards on that list do you think shouldn't (or should) be there? I've been playing since around when Zendikar came out so I wasn't playing while many of those cards were in standard. I know a bunch of them are on there because they are part of a degenerate combo (Blazing Shoal, Second Sunrise, Seething Song, Punishing Fire, SFM, Skullclamp, Sword of the Meek). Artifact Lands are banned simply because they were a bad idea to print to begin with.

Ancestral Vision
Bloodbraid Elf
Deathrite Shaman
Dread Return
Glimpse of Nature
Golgari Grave-Troll
Ponder
Preordain
Punishing Fire
Sensei's Divining top

All seem weird, why do they hate consistency so much?

Shoe wrote:why do they hate consistency so much?

Consistency leads to a stale format.

If Ancestral Vision, Ponder, and Preordain were legal Blue would easily (if it isn't already) be the most played color. Bloodbraid Elf, DRS, and Punishing Fire at different times made Jund too good. Dread Return because Dredge is really good and because it could make reanimator strategies broken. Glimpse of Nature because Elves is a deck, also because it's broken. Golgari Grave-Troll because they're worried that Dredge will be too powerful.

Sensei's Divining Top is one of the most ridiculous cards ever printed. Sensei's + Counterbalance = {1}: Counter target spell. That's the cornerstone of legacy UW miracles which is a hugely successful deck. If that were in modern it would completely dominate the format.

There are two cards on the list that really bug me. Mental Misstep and Deathrite Shaman. I know they are both good. I know Misstep showed up in tons of decks but they are both very recently printed and neither is part of any degenerate combo. Format warping is a lame excuse sometimes.

Also even if Ancestral Vision is played fair (suspended instead of cascaded into) it's pretty broken in a format that actively tries to stifle combo strategies.

gumgodMTG wrote:Format warping is a lame excuse sometimes.

If Mental Misstep were legal, then every single deck would literally have to be 56 cards and 4x Misstep, just to have a shot at combatting your opponent's Misstep and actually landing a first-turn play once in a while.

Kammikaze wrote:Sensei's Divining Top is one of the most ridiculous cards ever printed. Sensei's + Counterbalance = {1}: Counter target spell. That's the cornerstone of legacy UW miracles which is a hugely successful deck. If that were in modern it would completely dominate the format.

The way I heard it, that one's not actually related to power level or consistency, it's just that Sensei's Top leads to too much shuffling of unwanted top cards back into the library, which makes tournaments tend to drag ass as every. Single. Round goes to time and extra turns.

IronMagus wrote:

gumgodMTG wrote:Format warping is a lame excuse sometimes.

If Mental Misstep were legal, then every single deck would literally have to be 56 cards and 4x Misstep, just to have a shot at combatting your opponent's Misstep and actually landing a first-turn play once in a while.

Kammikaze wrote:Sensei's Divining Top is one of the most ridiculous cards ever printed. Sensei's + Counterbalance = {1}: Counter target spell. That's the cornerstone of legacy UW miracles which is a hugely successful deck. If that were in modern it would completely dominate the format.

The way I heard it, that one's not actually related to power level or consistency, it's just that Sensei's Top leads to too much shuffling of unwanted top cards back into the library, which makes tournaments tend to drag ass as every. Single. Round goes to time and extra turns.

Or you could just not play 1 drops and drop a chalice at 1... :D Also Dismember is playable in every deck, but it's not IN every deck. Same with Gitaxian Probe.

I've also read that about top, but it's legal in other formats, so that seems to be a strange reason.

IronMagus wrote:

Kammikaze wrote:Sensei's Divining Top is one of the most ridiculous cards ever printed. Sensei's + Counterbalance = {1}: Counter target spell. That's the cornerstone of legacy UW miracles which is a hugely successful deck. If that were in modern it would completely dominate the format.

The way I heard it, that one's not actually related to power level or consistency, it's just that Sensei's Top leads to too much shuffling of unwanted top cards back into the library, which makes tournaments tend to drag ass as every. Single. Round goes to time and extra turns.

Sensei's in the Counter-Top combo (The only place I've seen it played in Legacy) is only used for the top-deck manipulation. No shuffling involved there. If shuffling does happen it's because of something else, not the Top.

Mental Misstep is banned because WotC doesn't like free counterspells.

Shoe wrote:Ancestral Vision
Bloodbraid Elf
Deathrite Shaman
Dread Return
Glimpse of Nature
Golgari Grave-Troll
Ponder
Preordain
Punishing Fire
Sensei's Divining top

All seem weird, why do they hate consistency so much?

Bloodbraid and Deathrite got the axe because they made Jund too powerful and Jund was the strongest archtype right from the inception of modern.

Dread Return and Golgari Grave Troll were banned to effectively remove Dredge from Modern.

Ponder, Preordain and Ancestral were banned because it made Storm more consistant and basically sped up how fast the deck could go off.

Glimpse of Nature I dont remember the reasoning behind this, but watching Legacy Elves go off from this, I can understand why.

Punishing Fire basically made it impossible to use aggro decks since any creature with 2 toughness couldnt exist on the battlefield because it Punishing Fire's interation with Grove of the Burnwillows.

Sensei's Divining Top was banned namely because of the time delay it puts in matches. Yes Counterbalance is a reason too but it was basically banned for the same reason it was banned in standard because everydeck ran it and matches were constantly taking too long since there was too much use of top to look at the top of your deck before you draw, after you draw, after you shuffle, and in response to spells.

And Mental Misstep was axed because it gave "free" Counterpellls to non-blue decks and nerfed to many early turn plays. If it was too powerful for Legacy, then it def needed to be banned in Modern.