Topic: Rule questioning - First Strike Deatchtouch/Double Blocks

Hey guys,

I have to admit MTG is pissing me off because it throws my logic into self-confidence issues every time I face a situation.
Here's my problem today:
Opponent controls Ankle Shanker and attacks.
I control Sidisi, Brood Tyrant and was able to trigger it twice before, therefore I have 2 2/2 black zombies.
I decide to block Ankle Shanker with both Zombies thinking, he will assign ALL the damage to a single target and my other zombie would bash it off.

Forget that Ankle Shanker is Deathtouch, he is a 2/2, therefore he needs to assign the whole 2 damage to a zombie before it dies.
Now remember it is, then if the zombie would be 2/3, it would still be dead according to the Deathtouch rule that mentions any damage is enough damage to destroy defending creature.

If you guys can help me with rules supporting your opinions, I'd be more than grateful.

Thanks.

Edit:
Rule 510.1c:  A blocked creature assigns its combat damage to the creatures blocking it. If no creatures are currently blocking it (if, for example, they were destroyed or removed from combat), it assigns no combat damage. If exactly one creature is blocking it, it assigns all its combat damage to that creature. If two or more creatures are blocking it, it assigns its combat damage to those creatures according to the damage assignment order announced for it. This may allow the blocked creature to divide its combat damage. However, it can’t assign combat damage to a creature that’s blocking it unless, when combat damage assignments are complete, each creature that precedes that blocking creature in its order is assigned lethal damage. When checking for assigned lethal damage, take into account damage already marked on the creature and damage from other creatures that’s being assigned during the same combat damage step, but not any abilities or effects that might change the amount of damage that’s actually dealt. An amount of damage that’s greater than a creature’s lethal damage may be assigned to it.

Rule 702.2b:  Any nonzero amount of combat damage assigned to a creature by a source with deathtouch is considered to be lethal damage, regardless of that creature's toughness

Last edited by Jay4prez (2014-11-06 19:06:03)

Re: Rule questioning - First Strike Deatchtouch/Double Blocks

Well, you've wrote the answer there, yourself, by quoting the rules.  It's right there in 702.2b.  Let me see if I can clarify for you, some.

Jay4prez wrote:

Forget that Ankle Shanker is Deathtouch, he is a 2/2, therefore he needs to assign the whole 2 damage to a zombie before it dies.

You can't just "forget" that he has deathtouch.  The rule isn't "it can't assign combat damage to a creature that's blocking it unless ... each creature that precedes that blocking creature in its order is assigned damage equal to its toughness," which is how you seem to be interpreting it.  The actual rule is "it can't assign combat damage to a creature that's blocking it unless ... each creature that precedes that blocking creature in its order is assigned lethal damage."  The key, here, is rule 702.2b which states that "Any nonzero amount of damage assigned to a creature by a source with deathtouch is considered to be lethal damage, regardless of that creature's toughness."

So, the Ankle Shanker may not assign any combat damage to the second zombie, unless "lethal damage" has been assigned to the first one already.  But because it has deathtouch, any amount of damage Ankle Shanker assigns to a creature is considered "lethal damage."  Any amount that isn't zero, that is.  So, as long as it has assigned at least one damage to the first zombie, then it has assigned "lethal damage" and can then assign damage to the second zombie, as well.  Were it not for deathtouch, you would be correct, but since it has both deathtouch and first strike, your zombies are dead before they can hit back, and Ankle Shanker survives the combat unscathed.

Last edited by IronMagus (2014-11-06 19:37:31)

Re: Rule questioning - First Strike Deatchtouch/Double Blocks

Thank you IronMagus, you cleared things up and saved the day.
Actually, I lost because of that but that's okay. I'll just... keep crying at night.
I was misinterpreting the rules.