Topic: [Casual] I could use some help with a Nicol Bolas deck.

http://deckbox.org/sets/296019  This is a deck list focusing on chump blockers with deathtouch to keep their creatures at bay.

http://deckbox.org/sets/296382  This deck list is cheaper (always better) and focuses more on drawing what I want, and Grimgrin.

Update: I now have a couple deck lists with Nicol Bolas as the highlight, each of which do similar things with the spells, but the creatures are totally different.  These two deck-lists are exactly what I am after though.  I like the deathtouch chump blocker deck. I think it has survival, and may even make my opponent stall which plays highly in my favor once Bolas enters the battlefield and I yank a creature.  The other is actually an aggressive front using zombies and beefing Grimgrin but ultimately bides me time until I can get Bolas on the battlefield and start locking them down.

So far what I have put together is under $150 and I would really like to stay within that price range.  This would be a deck I use mostly in two headed giant games, and perhaps one on one with the knowledge that it will not be very powerful in a 1v1 situation.

I like some help maybe combining the two ideas, or pointing out which is actually more powerful during play.

Several views, no feedback. What gives? Please folks, any criticism is good criticism in my opinion!

Last edited by albonation (2013-01-19 22:03:52)

Re: [Casual] I could use some help with a Nicol Bolas deck.

A few thoughts.

First off, given that they're for casual play, you probably don't have to worry about a lot of the higher end standard cards, but keep in mind that most the counter-magic can be dealt with via a single Cavern of Souls. 

Gem of Becoming might seem pricey, but it will guarantee your land drops beyond turn four - a big part of getting Bolas out in a reasonable time-frame.

I'd also look at picking up some sort of board wipe to deal with opposing creatures.  This could be done in any of your colors with black (Mutilate and Killing Wave are likely the cheapest options), blue (Devastation Tide and Cyclonic Rift are fun options), and red (Mizzium Mortars, Blasphemous Act, or even Electrickery for small enough targets).  If Bolas is the real plan, you have to plan on clearing the board at least once in turn 5-7, less you will likely be overrun.

For the deathtouch stalling build, if you're just looking to put stuff in the way to stall, Typhoid Rats or even Giant Scorpion would be good options - they're cheap AND they offer more deathtouch.  I would swap Pyroclasm for Rolling Temblor as it will clear the ground targets, i.e., the goblins, while leaving your Baleful Strix alive (AND it can be flashed back).  Also, how are you not running Vampire Nighthawk?  Hanweir Lancer would be another cheap option to help enhance your blockers as deathtouch paired with first strike is a pretty solid wall to deal with.

For the zombie build, it'd be worth it to pick up the Diregraf Ghouls to give you something at the one-drop.  As strange as it seems, a 2/2 on turn one can make all the difference, even in the late game.  I would also look to more concrete removal options, i.e., Terror/Doom Blade/Go For the Throat/Murder as you can then deal with creatures that stretch beyond the initial 3 toughness that you're often limited to with your Brimstone Volleys (I know the morbid trigger helps, but it's often a bad idea to end up relying on them).  Lastly, if you're running zombies, any of the lords could be huge (they're pricey, but dropping $10 for a few Undead Warchiefs or Zombie Masters can help immensely).

In either build I can see where you might have some issues with anything that is flyer-centric, so you need to be sure to have the removal options at your disposal.

Anyway, best luck with them.

Re: [Casual] I could use some help with a Nicol Bolas deck.

To echo a little bit here, Gem of Becoming should almost be an auto-include if you're trying to drop Bolas.

Also, why aren't you running Cemetery Reaper?  It's a cheap card, and buffs all of your zombies, and is even capable of making some himself.  Bloodgift Demon might be a good idea to keep your hand in good shape later in the game.  Also, Mikaeus, the Unhallowed gives you some extra utility from your creatures, while giving you some protection against humans.

If you ask me which build is better for what you're talking about, I'd say the deathtouchy one.  Counter magic is great in Grixis, and really helps you stall until you can drop Bolas on their heads.

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Re: [Casual] I could use some help with a Nicol Bolas deck.

Awesome! Very nice feedback guys, even with nearly eight hours scouring through gatherer adding in and taking out cards you both came in and opened my eyes.

@TyWooOneTime - I recently stumbled upon your deck using the Paradox Haze way of quickly reducing the number of suspend counters on very large creatures.  I am tempted in going for this deck it looks very awesome.  Compared to my two would you choose the Paradox Haze way as the better way?  I am aiming at building a Nicol Bolas multiplayer deck, so we are talking using it in 2 headed giant games and 3 or 4 person free for all matches.

I considered Vampire Nighthawk, as well as Tidehollow Strix.  There are just so damned many options out there when you are opening yourself up to 3 three colors, and not just 3 colors but Red, Blue, and Black!


@drgolovacroxby - Thanks. Those are some awesome suggestions for the zombie side of things. Cemetery Reaper looks like the shiznittle against my friends little undying deck.  Do you have some suggestions for counter magic?

Re: [Casual] I could use some help with a Nicol Bolas deck.

Without spending ludicrous amounts of money, Counterspell is still the boss.  With mana leak right behind.  You've already got the right countermagic for what you're playing, fortunately.

EDIT: If you ever wanted to get stupid with it, get Force of Will and Mana Drain.

Last edited by drgolovacroxby (2013-01-20 02:18:04)

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Re: [Casual] I could use some help with a Nicol Bolas deck.

Thanks. I have 4 Counterspell and 4 Mana Leak here at the house, so that helps.  Mana Drain looks like the pimp of all pimps for counter magic.  I really just don't much like Force of Will, the 1 life is not a big deal but removing a card in your hand from the game seems like a steep cost to counter something.  I just look at it like you are using two cards to deal with one of theirs.  However needing 0 mana to counter a spell is pretty damned crunk.

Ha! But yeah total cost is a big deal, so the cheaper counter magic will have to do.

Edit: Oh should I be running Gem of Becoming and Gilded Lotus?

Last edited by albonation (2013-01-20 02:30:07)

Re: [Casual] I could use some help with a Nicol Bolas deck.

I like what you've got right now, with two of each.  You need mana to pilot that deck successfully, and two of each should be sufficient to get there.

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Re: [Casual] I could use some help with a Nicol Bolas deck.

With regard to the Paradox Haze build, you would end up having to drop a pretty substantial amount of cash to put that together as the deck then revolves around Jhoira of the Ghitu and using her ability to suspend all your big creatures/spells.  This does open the door for some rather amusing combos and some abuse of effects that occur in your upkeep, i.e., Venser's Journal.  I actually have a build put together centering on this exact idea at: http://deckbox.org/sets/190751

Aside from that, Counterspell is easily the most cost-effective countermagic out there (in terms of dollars spent for a great, versatile card), just be careful not to rely too much on countermagic as I stated earlier, as one of your buddies scoring a few Caverns will totally ruin your plan.

Re: [Casual] I could use some help with a Nicol Bolas deck.

Cool.

Large deck at 65 cards however.  25 lands and 4 artifacts able to keep the mana coming is crucial. 

What do you think of the Ponder and the Foresee?  I think the card draw and topdecking is crucial in this deck, a key component?

Six counter magic spells, and 4 instants to help against flying attackers as well as throwing first strike on my deathtouch.

I am on the fence about Blasphemous Act.  I think Rolling Temblor would stomp the tokens and is more friendly with my own creatures.  If this is the case then I can drop the Blasphemous mainboard the Temblor and that opens 4 spots on the sideboard.

Edit: Mizzium Mortars is really what I need to be playing as a board wipe, but only because of the overload.  I just am afraid that I will not be able to consistently produce 3 red mana in one turn like that.

Last edited by albonation (2013-01-20 04:21:18)

Re: [Casual] I could use some help with a Nicol Bolas deck.

@TyWooOneTime - Yeah I copied that deck list into my profile.  I have read that forum thread a few times in which you and a few other guys discussed it.  I really like it, it would crush my friends I think.  It is being priced out less than $100, I actually had all the cards in that deck in my shopping cart and ready to check out over on Card Kingdom.  I decided to hold off just a second to see if anyone had replied here to my forum post and..holy moly!  The friggin guy whose deck list I was about to purchase replied to me!  Crazy stuffs.

I can totally swing the dollar amount that deckbox is projecting for your decklist TyWooOneTime.  That is what I am after getting Bolas in play in multiplayer for $100 or less.

Re: [Casual] I could use some help with a Nicol Bolas deck.

The size of the deck might seem a bit daunting, but it's made up for with the variety of tutor/draw effects in the deck.  Nightscape Familiar already cuts the cost of your red and blue spells, but Demonic Tutor, Diabolic Tutor, and Bringer of the Black Dawn can all ensure you end up drawing the pieces you want.  Pair that with the draw engines in Shrine of Piercing Vision and Bringer of the Blue Dawn, which are both further enhanced by having a Paradox Haze in play.

With regard to the Mortars, at least the list I'm sitting on has 17 red mana symbols between the lands and artifacts.  Mind you, you could balance it even better if you were to toss in the RTR/Gatecrash shocks, i.e., Steam Vents, Blood Crypt and Watery Grave could help, in addition to the Innistrad/Core duals... suffice to say, getting to 6 wouldn't be much of a problem.  Cyclonic Rift could also fit the one sided board hit spot too.

In either event, best of luck with it.  I can honestly say I haven't updated this build in several months and can probably think of a few ways to improve it, but if you're down to spend the cash, I say run with it.  (Side note, Defiler of Souls could also be fun in there too!)

Re: [Casual] I could use some help with a Nicol Bolas deck.

I own 4 Drowned Catacombs, so maybe just buying 4 Dragonskull Summit, and then using basic lands beyond that would be best?  That way my land base is a bit faster.

Re: [Casual] I could use some help with a Nicol Bolas deck.

I got it down to 60 cards!

Now to just settle the Blasphemous Act spot. 

Edit: Dropped Blashpemous Act and added Evacuation.  It will ruin tokens no matter their toughness, which is actually a problem for me because my buddies white token deck really beefs them up.

Last edited by albonation (2013-01-20 05:17:07)