Topic: Gruul aggro 2 mid

Im ok with building deck i just always just tend to go over board with number of cards. just need some tweeking with the decks if some1 is willing. some are just build but dont have all the cards.

deck for 2014 standard so far:

http://deckbox.org/sets/519533

http://deckbox.org/sets/481255

http://deckbox.org/sets/481257

Thanx in advance.

Re: Gruul aggro 2 mid

So these are all decks for what? Casual play? FNM? Taking to a Grand Prix?

Are you simply looking for recommendations on which cards to cut?  Or are you open to complete overhauls?

What sort of budget are you looking at to improve the decks?

How competitive is the meta where you will be taking these to play?  Do you have to worry about a bunch of home brews or are you staring down Tier 1 net-decks all day long?

What are the basic win-cons and strategies behind each of the decks?

This is in the sticky about posting in the forum but I guess nobody reads that, so I'll say it again.  You have to give us some information regarding the decks and the questions I've posed above.  The more information you provide, the more likely it is that we can offer some helpful advice/input/critiques.

Re: Gruul aggro 2 mid

hehe sorry first time posting. as the post topic states its an aggressive to midrange deck idea. fast with 2 drop mana creatures and mana generators to get big creatures out quickly. I try to get 60-63 card decks plus the sideboard so help and tips to tweak the cards and correct number of them would help. format is standard. FNM and Pro Tour styles. Next year im aiming to pro up my magic play. budget small to medium. ill invest if it lasts. normally i make with wat i have.
mainly home brew decks. and very competitive. strategies is to pump mana get fatties out and smash face aspa.

Re: Gruul aggro 2 mid

Okay, so if you're playing in a really competitive environment, I'm going to be 100% frank and honest with you about the builds.  Home-brews or not, if you're in a really competitive environment you need to know some of the basics of deckbuilding.

1) Pick a strategy and stick to it!  This means either going aggro, going midrange, or going control these days.  Do NOT hedge between two of them as it will almost always weaken your ability to do either - making the deck worse than it would be if you simply picked one.  So to this end, you REALLY need to choose, are you going for an aggro strategy or for more of a midrange strategy?  Then stick to that!

2) Consistency, consistency, consistency!  The most competitive decks typically run very few different cards but in high quantities (3-4x of most cards).  The reason for this is because they want to have the best odds of drawing the same sorts of plays every game - allowing them to follow similar lines of play in every game, reducing play mistakes while also maximizing the likelihood of executing the plan.

3) Some cards are just better than others.  I know how tempting it is to take a card that nobody else is using and try to figure out a way to "break the format" with it.  The same can be said for trying to come up with your own unique builds as opposed to looking to what the pros are doing and "net-decking."  As much as it pains me, as a brewer of weird decks myself, there is no reason to reinvent the wheel, so to speak.  Look at what the pros are playing, take their decklists and feel free to modify them to fit what you own and can get your hands on, BUT, simply ignoring what they're doing because "net-decking sucks" is just silly.  They're the best players in the world for a reason and they spend a LOT more time thinking about this stuff than probably 90% of the rest of us.  That being said, if they're not running a card, don't think they simply forgot it, there's probably a reason they're not running it.

4) Mana fixing is expensive, but it is that way for a reason.  If you're sitting on the playset of Stomping Grounds you've already done the hard part.  But Temple of Abandon is pretty huge when it comes to competitive play these days.  It may come in tapped, slowing you down a bit, but the scry ability can keep you from flooding out or drawing repetitive cards that you can't cast.  It's worth it to spend a few extra bucks or to trade to pick up the added mana fixing (although the full playsets of everything aren't required, it's more consistent if you have them all).

So, with those out of the way, to your builds:

1) "Slammed Gruul" - This deck is FAR too disorganized to really have much consistency.  Are you going aggro or mid-range?  If you're aggro, mana dorks are TERRIBLE.  If you're going mid-range, you need to really just follow the R/G Devotion builds and have 4x Burning-Tree Emissary (BTE), Voyaging Satyr, Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx, Garruk, Caller of Beasts and all that jazz.  As it currently sits, very little of this makes much sense given the high number of 1-off cards.  For instance, Legion Loyalist is meant to achieve what exactly (mind you, I know what the card does...)?  Or 1x Bow of NyleaFog seems totally counter to an aggro strategy and would be better suited in mid-range.

2) "Test 1" - This is leaps and bounds better than "Slammed Gruul" but still has a long way to go.  This again is hedged between aggro and mid-range.  If you're going aggro (and hence most of the reason to run Ghor-Clan Rampager and Ogre Battledriver), I would suggest tossing in a LOT more one and two-drop creatures and realistically ending your curve at four.  Drop all the mana dorks and work with things like Experiment One, Firefist Striker, the full slate of BTEs, more Kalonian Tuskers, and Domri Rade.  Drop essentially ALL of your enchantments as the only ones that would matter for such a build are Hammer of Purphoros (it replaces late game land draws with 3/3 haste golems), Madcap Skills, and POSSIBLY Dragon Mantle.

3) "Test 2" - This is also better than "Slammed Gruul" and appears to be adopting the mid-range strategy a bit more.  But it still has a bunch of sub-optimal cards.  Among those I would cut are: Deadbridge Goliath, Ghor-Clan Rampager, Fog, Mending Touch, Alpha Authority, Bow of Nylea, and Purphoros's Emissary.  Others I would consider possibly cutting or maybe moving to the SB depending on how the build shapes up include: Kalonian Tusker, Savageborn Hydra, Scavenging Ooze, Giant Adephage.   Now you're probably thinking to yourself, "That's all of the deck! What in the world goes in there!?!"  Well, Polukranos is a more versatile threat than most of what you're sitting on.  So he should be in there as probably a 3x.  Arbor Colossus is a 6/6 for 5 that can easily become a 9/9 and take out an opposing flyer (which is quite relevant against Desecration Demon and things of the like).  BTE is a devotion generator.  Sylvan Caryatid is easily the best mana dork these days as it can block most aggro threats safely while still adding to the pool.  Also, Garruk, Caller of Beasts provides a HUGE amount of card advantage.  Personally I'm a fan of a few unorthodox things like Clan Defiance to give you an output for all your mana in the later turns.  But more importantly, you have to be sure that you stick to the plan and keep producing big threats (but not so big that a single removal spell screws you over - hence my hesitation about Giant Adephage).

So, there's clearly a lot of room for improvement (sorry) if you're in a super competitive situation.  My suggestion would be to either try to pick up some more of the core pieces for the R/G Devotion deck over time and perhaps scout out a few other FNM spots (if possible) to find a less competitive environment to start or try making incremental improvements to the existing builds, but keep in mind that you need to be okay with losing quite a bit.  Because if I can say one thing, it's that GP/Pro Tour competition would eat these lists quickly and easily given that they're almost all playing the same 8-10 tier 1 tested lists of 75 cards.  Further, to be competitive in those environments, you have to be willing to pony up a bit more cash... today's game is a far cry from when I started in 1993-94 when it really was just "What cards do you have? Yeah, build with those."

If you'd like, I have an R/G Devotion build I've been tinkering with for a while although I haven't playtested it nearly enough to know if it would perform well or not.  In either event, the build can be found here: http://deckbox.org/sets/474989.  I'm hardly a GP winning brewer, but I've taken down enough FNM events in my day to have at least some sense of what I'm doing.  Feel free to take what you like from it and remember, the most important input you can get is from playtesting - it trumps whatever we can tell you in these forums.  So build, playtest, build, playtest, build, playtest, playtest, playtest.

Good luck!

Re: Gruul aggro 2 mid

ok cool thanx yeah i only started working now so hopely money wont bother that much but very hard to get stuff this side and it really is alot of money. i could not order from overseas and stores were always sold out. as about "slammed gruul" as name says it was slammed together for casual event. im a TO so i sometimes get asked to play to fill the space. no i get what you saying and some cards are wow. i will share that ember swollower has helpped me tons in that deck. when it him monster i screwed other guys land up badly while i had mana dorks as you call them that still keep my mana flowing. Voyaging sytar is awesome. im looking for temple of abadon and legion loyalist and BTE just very hard to find. thats why im still stuck between the two strats and trading need to win good cards to trade them. just to give u insight about the money $1 = x10 buy us. So its hard to just buy cash and thats if u find the cards you need. but thanks man ill see what i can do. keep checking back ill try and get cards and update the list. ok with cards i have can u suggest what i can drop to get 60-63 card deck?

Re: Gruul aggro 2 mid

oh and the test decks are just built here on deckbox. i do not have all those cards. slammed gruul is about the cards i do have.:P