Topic: [Standard][Opinions] Evolving BUGs

So with Gatecrash right around the corner, I've been intrigued by the evolve mechanic that Simic is bringing to the table.  The new shocklands also make it easy to run a three color deck, as such, I noticed the potential for evolve to pair with Corpsejack Menace to have a bit of fun.  Further, splashing black lets one include Golgari Charm which can be a hilarious response to someone's Supreme Verdict.

The deck can be seen here:  http://deckbox.org/sets/299659

The basic idea here is to really capitalize on the +1/+1 counters.  I'm most concerned with the problems on the front end of the curve, as the 4-6 range practically built itself - 4 drops are Master Biomancers and Corpsejacks, 5 drops include Thragtusks and Conjurer's Closets (flickering things with evolve is epic), and six drops include Deadeye Navigators (more flickering is good) and 2x Prime Speaker Zeganas (flicker her and she guarantees the rest of your board evolves while also letting you draw a bunch of cards - toss in the Corpsejack and you're guaranteed to draw at least 10 cards).

On the front end I have a variety of plays available.

Cloudfin Raptor - potentially the next Delver?  In either event it offers a one-drop flyer with evolve - never a bad thing.

Faerie Impostor - offers another one drop flyer, but, more importantly returns creatures to my hand to allow for more evolve triggers.

Shambleshark - the key here is flash, which I also capitalize on with Alchemist's Refuge.  This turns any creature card in your hand into a combat trick - take that Gruul and bloodrush!

Elusive Krasis - really this is for the evolve trigger but also to provide a four-toughness three drop to ensure I keep hitting those triggers.

Simic Fluxmage and Simic Manipulator - little known fact, but the way Corpsejack is worded, simply moving those +1/+1 counters results in them doubling.  The most useful target being Simic Manipulator - if you flicker the Corpsejack, putting two counters on both the fluxmage and manipulator, then you pay two to move a counter to the manipulator, resulting in him having four counters and making it possible to take anything with power four or less for only two mana (yes plz).

I have seven removal spells in Rapid Hybridization, Abrupt Decay, and Murder - these should cover my arse for a while until my creatures evolve into bigger threats.

Farseek is pretty self explanatory.

In the board I have answers for Hexproof decks, token decks (Illness in the Ranks will totally wreck Esper tokens), board wipes, major threats that come back, aggro decks (imagine Tree of Redemption flickering - you keep evolving things and can't go below 13 life as it'll revert back to normal each time), and enchantments/artifacts.

So what are your thoughts?  I can imagine there are several weaknesses here.  I'm not really picturing this as a tier 1 deck by any stretch of the imagination, but it certainly looks like fun to play.

Re: [Standard][Opinions] Evolving BUGs

So the decklist has changed slightly with the Navigators biting the dust to give way for another Master Biomancer and some other numbers to shift around.

Still no thoughts?

Re: [Standard][Opinions] Evolving BUGs

Sorry I must have missed the first posting, first off I'm scared just thinking about Corpsejack Menace into Prime Speaker, draw 8 with no one else on the board, jeez that's scary. I think that flickering might now be your best option without more targets however, Thragtusk and the Prime speaker are pretty sweet to flicker but if you don't have one you don't want to flicker your evolve creatures, and although Corpsejack and the master biomancer will evolve alot of your guys they won't get them any higher than 4-5 usually so by the time you're flickering they're probably beyond realistic evolving range.

I don't love your removal package personally, Devour Flesh seems really weak against anything that isn't just play a GoST and win deck. I'm not sure about Agoraphobia either, seems like it leaves them with a blocker either way and It's nice to have repeatable removal  but I don't think this card is worthwhile. if you can pick up Simic Charms they're pretty boss, none of the effects are really worth 2 but they're all very useful, it is never a dead card unless there are no creatures on the board at all. Sever also seems worthwhile in the Main deck, with farseeks and a slightly slower build I'd say if you're not playing against aggro you'll probably be able to flash it back in most games.

I'm not sure about the Manipulator, if there's a deck it would be good in it's yours for sure, otherwise it probably won't get enough counters to do anything, but I'd like to hear how it works out for you.

Anything specific you're playing against in your meta, I can give better advice if I know what I'm dealing with smile

http://deckbox.org/users/imsully2

Re: [Standard][Opinions] Evolving BUGs

Thanks for the thoughts.  I too was with you thinking Agoraphobia was crap, that was, of course, until someone pointed out the combo it makes with Simic Manipulator.  I can shrink their creatures, take them, and then simply pick the enchantment back up to repeat on a new target.

The thought of Corpsejack Menace paired with ANY of these things is just nasty. Think, T3 Master Biomancer (thanks Farseek) curves into a T4 Corpsejack, which just happens to get 4 +1/+1 counters (as would every other creature you play afterward).  That pairing alone means I might not be evolving every time, but then a T8 topdecked Cloudfin Raptor isn't just a dead card.

I too am not comfortable with the removal options, but I was torn with regard for how else to go.  Obviously Mutilate would likely be worse for me than for them.  Similarly, given the three colors, I was trying to avoid things like Murder for the double symbols.  Obviously I can go that route if need be.  Similarly, Tragic Slip is always a good option, but one that is sadly underpowered unless things are dying.  Perhaps I should go with Prey Upon or Pit Fight since I'm likely going to have the biggest creature(s) on the field?  It's certainly a cheap option.  The rationale behind my leaning toward Devour Flesh came from the idea that it's instant speed, cheap, and can deal with ANYTHING, hexproof or not.  They have a choice if they have multiple creatures, but often times if something is really warranting removal, it's alone on the field.  But I'm definitely not set on the current list there.  I also thought Rapid Hybridization could serve as both an offensive and defensive spell, as I could, in theory, transform a Cloudfin Raptor or something into a 3/3 to block with AND hit a few evolve triggers.  I could see Sever in the mainboard, at least as a 2x of - not a problem.

I really do wish I had a clear idea of the meta at post-GTC as I'm sure a few players will shift things around, but I can say that one guy is running American mid-range (following the pro decklist to a T), another was running bant hexproof auras, one guy plays R/B zombies with Falkenrath Aristocrats and Blood Artists (although he doesn't play as frequently), another person is playing a strange four color control, and then there are your run of the mill tusk/angel whatnot decks.

In either event, thanks for the input.

Re: [Standard][Opinions] Evolving BUGs

I have been trying to work on a deck along a similar vein, though a bit of a different direction. Instead of trying to evolving huge dudes I went with trying to overwhelm with some resilient small dudes. It was inspired by the BUG list that Frank Lepore put on tcgplayer, though I went stronger into the Zombie theme. My list is below:

4 Gravecrawler
2 Deathrite Shaman
3 Lotleth Troll
3 Zameck Guildmage
1 Snapcaster Mage
3 Dreg Mangler
2 Duskmantle Seer

3 Rancor
2 Rapid Hybridization
1 Tragic Slip
3 Essence Scatter
2 Abrupt Decay
2 Golgari Charm
2 Spell Rupture
1 Dimir Charm
1 Simic Charm
1 Ultimate Price

3 Breeding Pool
3 Overgrown Tomb
3 Watery Grave
4 Drowned Catacomb
4 Woodland Cemetery
4 Hinterland Harbor
2 Alchemist's Refuge
1 Grim Backwoods

The list is still really rough. The primary angle of attack is as a BG Zombie deck, Gravecrawler into Lotleth Troll into Dreg Mangler. Even with the all dual mana base, I am still hesitant to run Messenger. Shaman and Seer are primarily just reach in a long game. Snapcaster and Guildmage are card advantage, again for the stalled long game. And yes the Guildmage can only draw cards off a Troll, salvaging a Mangler or most commonly its own first ability. Maybe Strangleroot Geist and Experiment One are better options than the Gravecrawler?

I am really not sure on the proper proportions of charms. Golgari has been the best in testing. Dimir gives a hard counter to miracles and Simic an out to Reanimator, though both may just be better in the sideboard. I guess it depends on what climbs to the top of the meta-heap for which charms are best to run. The same goes for the spot removal.

I really need help with a sideboard. I suck at creating sideboards. BUG is extremely versatile in sideboard cards, but the wealth of options kind of has me scratching my head. Also the meta hasn't solidified yet so I am really not sure what to expect from my opponents. A RDW variations, a Hexproof variation, a Thragtusk variation, and a Reanimator/combo variation would be my guesses.

Advice on a sideboard for the common expectation would be most appreciated.

Re: [Standard][Opinions] Evolving BUGs

Hey Jettjj,

I'd suggest making a new post in the decks and deckbuilding forums to increase the visibility of the deck so that you can get more feedback.  I have some thoughts, but I'll wait until you post there to sit and type them out.

Re: [Standard][Opinions] Evolving BUGs

TyWooOneTime wrote:

Hey Jettjj,

I'd suggest making a new post in the decks and deckbuilding forums to increase the visibility of the deck so that you can get more feedback.  I have some thoughts, but I'll wait until you post there to sit and type them out.

Done. Thanks. I thought it would have been better to keep both lists in the same thread, though while they have some similarities, they do diverge rather quickly in play style.